Sky News - Showdown

SUBJECTS: Craig Thomson saga; Coalition front bench E&OE…… Peter Van Onselen: Mr Pyne, thank you for your company. Christopher Pyne: Good to be with you Peter. Van Onselen: So are you trembling in your boots?  I mentioned before the break there would be real fear there in the Opposition if Kevin Rudd came back to the Labor leadership.  What say you? Pyne: Well, the Labor Party’s response to bad polls and incompetence, unpopularity, dysfunction and division is to break glass in case of emergency and change leader.  That’s what they did in NSW time and again.  It’s what they’re going to do federally.  They did it to Kevin Rudd and I’m sure they’re going to do it to Julia Gillard.  Rather than address the foundation problems that they have with the Australian electorate over trust and over competence they will simply change leader and think it will solve all their problems.  I can’t quite work out which one of these putative candidates for Prime Minister are going to have us panicking given that Kevin Rudd has already been dispatched once, no one has ever heard of Greg Combet and Steve Smith, Wayne Swan has been a complete disaster as the treasurer and Bill Shorten thinks that he’s Christmas, but I’m not sure the Australian public share his view. Van Onselen: Tell me this though.  If the Government is as bad as you guys say day in day out why is Tony Abbott as unpopular as Julia Gillard? Pyne: There are polls and there are polls Peter and the truth is the Newspoll came out the same day as the Morgan poll came out.  The Morgan poll showed the Coalition on 61 and a half per cent and Labor on 38 and a half.  It was the best result for the Coalition in 70 years. Van Onselen: But that’s because Morgan is face to face Mr Pyne and I’m sure with the way the Government is travelling at the moment no one wants to admit face to face that they might vote for them, but it doesn’t mean that they won’t in the secrecy of the ballot booth. Pyne: Well, I simply remember one statistic Peter and that is in 1996 when John Howard Saulwick poll in the Age and the Sydney Morning Herald had a preferred Prime Minister poll; Keating 47, Howard 42.  So John Howard was five points behind Paul Keating.  If you talked to the commentators and the historians today they’ll tell you Paul Keating was the most unpopular Prime Minister in history and yet he was still ahead of John Howard on Election Day in 1996. Van Onselen: Explain for me today the tactics.  It seems like there’s been a response in the tactics from the Coalition in relation to Newspoll and I guess concern more broadly perhaps that you’re looking a little too negative and Tony Abbott in particular is looking a little too negative.  There was no suspension of standing orders.  This is a question that has come from tweets from our viewers as well.  You almost made me late to pick up my daughter from swimming.  I assumed the suspension would happen and I could get out of question time early.  What’s going on?  Why not?  Are you worried?  Let’s be honest here, it’s just between you and me.  Are you worried you’re looking a little bit too negative and you want to change that up? Pyne: Look, Peter, we don’t do a suspension every day.  We do on occasion when we think it’s justified when the Prime Minister is refusing to answer questions as she usually does.  We don’t do it every day and the fact that the Labor Party whinges and moans and carps and complains about it so much only confirms in my mind that it is a very successful and effective tactic.  So we’re not about to go changing the fact that suspension motions are necessary because the Government doesn’t answer questions in Question Tim.  But I’m also not interested in being lectured by the Labor Party on negativity.  I was looking today at things John Faulkner had said about Mal Colston in 1997.  Just bear with me for one second.  He says, “I want to speak about someone who is venal.  I want to speak about someone who is unscrupulous.  I want to speak about someone who is a mercenary.  I want to speak about someone who is contemptible and despicable.  I want to speak about someone who is the most useless and abominable representative the federal parliament has ever seen.”  So the Labor Party lecturing the Liberal Party about negativity directed towards any particular member doesn’t cut the mustard with me I’m afraid given the things they used to say about Mal Colston. Van Onselen: I agree with that.  There’s no question that both sides of politics play it tough so when the Labor Party tries to cry foul on that in relation to what you guys are saying about Craig Thomson.  They don’t get any sympathy from me on that, but what about tactically though with the public?  It seems like you may be pulling back a little bit from the attack on Craig Thomson.  Is there any truth to that?  If not what are you looking for in terms of the Prime Minister can do on this? Pyne:  Well early last week the Prime Minister was overseas.  When she got back on Wednesday we switched our focus to asking questions to the Prime Minister about integrity, about character, about Craig Thomson and the things she has said over the last eighteen months, that she has continually said she has full confidence in Craig Thomson and said she wish he’d stay as the Member for Dobell for a long, long, long time.  And we obviously asked about the ridiculous situation she’s placed herself in where she’s set herself up as judge and jury to throw him out of the caucus and take his preselection away but then she criticises the Opposition for saying that he should be censured in the Parliament.  Now, nobody in Canberra and in the general public understands how she can be judge and jury for one of those things but then criticise other people for raising legitimate matters to do with the Member for Dobell. Van Onselen: I entirely agree with you on that, I think she is inconsistent on this, but put her inconsistency to one side for the moment.  You don’t honestly expect Craig Thomson to be removed from the Parliament before he’s actually been convicted of any particular wrongdoing do you, surely? Pyne:  Well if he’s convicted, if he’s charged and convicted of an offence that carries twelve months or more gaol term, he’s automatically expelled from the Parliament, and that’s the Constitution of Australia. Van Onselen: But that hasn’t happened so far, Mr Pyne.  Your side, certainly Tony Abbott, is calling for him to step down and depart Parliament.  At the end of the day, the Prime Minister can’t ask him to do that.  She’s kicked him out of the Labor Party, inconsistent as that might be with some of her other rhetoric, but what more can she do? Pyne:  Well I think we’re simply making the point that the only reason Craig Thomson is in the spotlight, is that in this hung parliament the Prime Minister is insisting that he remain in the Parliament so she can cling to power.  So she wants to distance herself from Craig Thomson but she wants to also collect his vote on the floor of the House of Representatives.  And if the Labor Party wants to complain about the Coalition asking legitimate questions about the Thomson affair then it’s within their power to solve that problem by letting Craig Thomson go.  By not accepting his vote, by letting him go on a leave of absence to repair his apparently failing health and therefore remove him from the spotlight.  They won’t do that, Peter, because they need his vote and that is the only reason they’ve clung to him all these years in the Parliament. Van Onselen: So would you like to see the Government pair his vote out basically?  I mean, they can’t force him out of Parliament, the Constitution tells us that but if they paired out his vote they would still have the numbers assuming Wilkie went with them and Katter went to your side while Slipper is out of the chamber.  Would that be enough? Pyne:  Well we think if his health is a big an issue as the Labor Party are claiming it is, I don’t remember them having that sympathy for Archbishop Hollingworth by the way when they hounded him from office as Mark Latham revealed last Monday night on Sky Television.  I don’t remember them having any sympathy at all for Archbishop Hollingworth.  But if they’re right and his health is an issue he can simply take a leave of absence and then he won’t be in the spotlight and he can go away and he can repair the damage that’s been done over the last couple of years I’m sure to his health and also protect his family and deal with these burdens that are obviously being placed on him because of the Fair Work Australia report. Van Onselen: So you’re not simply looking for a byelection in that seat?  Because I have heard others in the Coalition ranks go much harder than that in saying that he should basically step down which would force a byelection. Pyne:  Look if he was to take a leave of absence and not be voting on the floor of the House then the pressure on him would be massively reduced and that’s within Julia Gillard’s gift.  But Julia Gillard wants to stand up, dripping with hypocrisy and cant, and criticise the Opposition for pursuing legitimate political questions while she also insists that he remain in Canberra and vote in every division.  Now she can’t have it both ways and the public knows that.  And the only reason, of course, that the Labor Party’s polling has ticked up a bit in the Newspoll today is that in the last month they’ve spent tens of millions of dollars in government advertising of the so-called carbon tax compensation package and the National Broadband Network.  And they’ve given away hundreds of millions of dollars to people in cash handouts.  Now if you didn’t get some kind of bounce in the polls from that you know it would be very very surprising. Van Onselen: Well they’ve learnt from the best then haven’t they?  The Howard Government spent more than any government in history on propaganda advertising. Pyne: Well I think it is quite noteworthy that I heard today that in fact the Department of Finance had knocked back the Governments proposals to advertise the school kids bonus because it was so political and misleading because it is not linked to education at all and the Labor Party are going to apparently pay for those adds themselves. So every time you turn on television or radio, you can’t miss an ad about the carbon tax package and about the NBN and soon, Labor Party ads about the school kid’s non education bonus. Van Onselen: Mr Pyne, every time I listen to question time the opposition is always parading information from companies that are either going bust, or are struggling, or shutting down operations were they have included one of the factors being the carbon tax. Now, I am sure it is probably is a factor but it isn’t actually in play yet, but in their anticipation, their preparation of course it may well be in play. You must know as well as most of us do that business at the end of the day is not going to come out and say that the reason why operations are closing is plain and simple mismanagement of their own, or factors like that. They’re going to throw a liltingly of factors in to the mix, that doesn’t really take us any further than we were getting taken by companies ahead of the  instruction of GST does it? When they were all claiming it was an evil that was contributing to economic problems in the economy. The Liberal Party knows business as well as anyone; you should know that businesses are always just going to throw that in to the mix even if it is only a minor factor. Pyne: Well that isn’t quite correct Peter, we do differentiate. For example the Hastie’s closure we haven’t blamed on the carbon tax, but we have used it as an example that now is the worst time to be hitting the economy with an economy wide reckonable carbon tax that will force up prices and damage jobs. But with respect to the Brindabella Airlines today, the Airline themselves said the carbon tax was the final nail in the coffin for the roots, or the services they could no longer afford to keep because of the carbon tax. So there are clear discrepancies between, or differences between companies depending on whether they can quite clearly blame the carbon tax like the aviation industry, the aluminium industry, the coal industry, the steel industry, the tourism industry, and of course economy wide the carbon tax will force up prices and damage the economy. Everyone knows it, and it won’t make any difference to the outcomes of emissions as emissions goes up in the rest of the world as industries leave and go offshore; and that is just pure common sense, the Australian public knows it. I heard today that Julia Gillard told her members to go out and sell the carbon tax in schools; well I mean good luck with that, good luck with that. Van Onselen: She is probably thinking of the next raft of voters that might be in by the time Labor is competitive in the Polls. Moving on, there has been a tweet that has come in, a few fans of you on Twitter. One says Pyne is a great parliamentary performer, definite future Prime Minister, maybe after Abbotts third term.  This brings me to the issue of the configuration of the front bench Mr Pyne. Let’s be honest. Pyne: Your favourite subject. Van Onselen: Tell it as it is, do you think the best talent in the parliamentary Liberal Party is currently residing on the Liberal front bench. Pyne: Look Peter we are so lucky to have an embarrassment of riches on both the front bench, and the back bench. Van Onselen: That wasn’t the question; you know that wasn’t the question. Pyne: I’m just answering the question, I know this is your favourite subject, but we are very lucky to have so many talented people on both the front bench and the back bench. Of course there are very good people that would make great front benchers, but not everybody can be a frontbencher; there are only so many portfolios. Van Onselen: Because there is dead wood that won’t get out of the way, and Tony Abbott won’t move. Do you think you’ll do it in Government though? Pyne: I have great regard for every one of my frontbench colleagues whom I work with very closely, and I think Tony Abbott is right when he says we have are best team on the paddock, and in government we will make a hopefully very formidable cabinet. There are 16 of the 22 members of the Shadow Cabinet were Ministers in the Howard Government, a successful government, and if Tony Abbott is elected as Prime Minister he will be the most experienced Prime Minister from Government in the history of Federation. Nobody would have been a Cabinet Minister as long as Tony Abbott who ever became Prime  Minister as well as been a Rhodes Scholar, and an economics graduate. Van Onselen: Alright. Well, I’ll make you a $100 bet that he changes the team pretty dramatically in government, but I won’t push you to take the best on air; we’ll discuss that off air. Christopher Pyne, Manager of Opposition Business we appreciate you jpoining us on showdown. Pyne: It is a pleasure, thank you. ENDS