Sky News - Richo

SUBJECTS: Fair Work Australia investigation into Craig Thomson; Coalition Policy

E&OE........ 

Graham Richardson: Good evening Christopher. 

Christopher Pyne: Good evening Graham. 

Richardson: We’re all starting the New Year.  We’re all fresh and happy.  And yet here we are again; there’s brawling in the parliament, there’s brawling amongst the staff, we’ve got all sorts of strife.  Now, let’s start with the aboriginal tent embassy and Tony Hodges before we get to other matters that have come up a bit later.  Do you really see a great conspiracy occurring here?  I can see evidence of stupidity, but not conspiracy. 

Pyne: Obviously there’s stupidity.  There’s also lack of judgement and I do think there’s a problem in the culture of the Labor Party or the Prime Minister’s office or both or in the Government in general where they think that these kinds of so called “clever” West Wing type actions designed to unsettle the Leader of the Opposition are smart politics.  I think dirty tricks and grubby deals really backfire on people and this was a very silly trick that has not just backfired, but is kind of the exploding cigar that’s blown up in the Prime Minister’s face because the worst footage from last week was the Prime Minister being dragged in a headlock downstairs, across a path and being shoved in the back of a car and losing her shoe like Marie Antoinette on her way to the guillotine.  It really couldn’t have been a worse look for the Government. 

Richardson: There wasn’t a lot of dignity in that, being dragged along the way she was, but isn’t it the case when the security detail determines there’s some sort of strife – and what I gather is they thought the glass was going to break from all the people banging on it.  Aren’t they supposed to get her in that car fast and do the job for which they’re trained? 

Pyne: I think the security group did exactly what they should have done.  I think the problem is it wouldn’t have happened in the first place if the Prime Minister’s office weren’t complicit in essentially trying to start an affray and that’s why it blew up in their face like the old exploding cigar gag and I think the problem for the Prime Minister’s office is that this is a pattern of behaviour.  They can’t win a trick.  That’s what’s playing on the minds of Labor MPs when they come back to Canberra next week. 

Richardson: I think you’re right although it is but one of the things that’s playing on the minds of Canberra MPs, but there are plenty of them.  Obviously that office has a lack of professionalism, but I’ll speak about that another time.  When you go on from that particular nasty incident and you look at tonight; revelations about emails between the office of Chris Evans when he was Industrial Relations Minister and Fair Work Australia.  I’ve seen a little bit of these emails.  Do you really believe there’s any great smoking gun here?  Is it ticking away because it seems to me to be just a case of saying “well, what really is going on”? 

Pyne: Well, Richo, the problem for this Government and this story is the Cabinet Ministers had been sent out over the last two days to indignantly deny any collusion between Fair Work Australia and the Government of any kind.  They were sent out today and last night to trash Kathy Jackson and say that her claims on the 7:30 Report were utter rubbish about a conspiracy between Fair Work Australia and the Government.  For months and months the Prime Minister has insisted there’s been no collusion between Fair Work Australia and the Government and yet these emails that have been exposed tonight on Channel 7 News clearly indicate that the office of the Minister for Industrial Relations at the time was involved with Fair Work Australia about getting assurances from them of the way they were handling media stories at the time in August last year.  A time which the Government was very sensitive about the Craig Thomson affair and yet we see a far too close relationship between Fair Work Australia and the Minister’s office in the face of blanket denials from cabinet ministers. 

Richardson: You’ve used the word collusion.  I’ve read a couple of the emails; I understand the flavour of them.  I don’t see any evidence of collusion.  There appears to be no attempt from either side to say “this is what we’re going to do, what do you think, is that ok?”  Neither side seems to be saying that do they.  There’s no collusion, but you might say with some justification there appears to be a bit of friendly relations between them.  I can’t see any collusion that’s nasty or dark and that has to be hidden, do you? 

Pyne: Well, I think the phrase, “Awesome, that means the story shouldn’t get any lift off tomorrow morning” really suggests there’s probably a great deal more going backwards and forwards between Fair Work Australia and the Minister’s office.  That is a sign off which suggests to me that the Minister’s office is happy with the way Fair Work Australia is responding to media inquires.  That confirms that we believe there has been an institutional go slow from Fair Work Australia on this Craig Thomson investigation, which lets face it has gone on for well over three years; longer than the Cole Royal Commission, longer than Wood Royal Commission.  How long does it take to investigate one particular use of a credit card by a HSU official? 

Richardson: Hang on, its just not doing that, three of than have been adversely named Kathy Jackson, Michael Williamson and him three not just one they have been investigating and in the union I think pretty I don’t know how many snouts were in the trough but there were a lot of them. I think they have had a lot to investigate that having been said it’s been hopelessly slow I’m not denying it, but getting back to the phrase used the ‘awesome’ one I mean wasn’t he really saying wacko we’ve had so many  bad things here this isn’t nearly as bad as we thought it might have been and so you’ve got a press secretary getting a bit orgasmic over it but again it doesn’t amount to collusion, there’s no evidence to me here I can’t see any line that says do what we’re telling you to do.

Pyne: I think in the court of public opinion Richo people will be saying hang on here’s a government that has been denying any relationship between Fair Work Australia and the government has been saying how independent they are how outrageous it is that we would suggest there be any communication between the two that they harken back to  Ben Hubbard’s call to Fair Work Australia in 2009 and essentially say all he was doing was finding out where the investigation was up to  what  they were actually starting and that since that time they’ve left it all up to Fair Work Australia, now we find in fact Fair Work Australia and the Ministers office were sending emails back and forth to each other  which seem to  suggest that there was some manipulation, some collusion about the message that was being given out to the press which Channel 7 was quite rightly pursing. I think in the court of public opinion, the public are going to  say all these hand on heart denials by Cabinet Ministers and the Prime Minister and in the parliament are have not been their wait at all.

Richardson: I can agree with you on that score, the court of public opinion this will look really bad but it is a story that will last only one or two days because there isn’t the smoking gun its really about what Hubbard did or allegedly did and that is say what’s going on. The clear thing is the guy tries to  find out what’s going on, finds out what is going on and says its not as bad a we might of thought , I can’t see where you can keep that one going. You’ll get a bit out of it but not as much as you probably want. But I want to move though because there not the only things that are happening in the world. Now yesterday your Leader actually made a speech where he talked about doing something but I’m unclear about some aspects of it which you might be able to clear up for me.

Pyne: I’ll try

Richardson: Firstly, tax cuts, where are you where are you on tax cuts are they happening or not happening?

Pyne: Well, basically with respect to things like tax cuts, a dental scheme that’s within Medicare, a national disability insurance scheme we’ve said that we want to do all of those things but we can’t do them until the budget is back in surplus but before the end of the first term of a coalition government there will be income tax cuts. We’ve obviously said that we are going to abolish the Carbon Tax which will be a tax cut immediately in the first few months of a Coalition government. That’s the answer to that question.

Richardson: Well, I introduced the dental scheme way, way, way back in 1993 which I think Peter Costello ditched in his first budget. But a dental scheme really is important isn’t it there are just so many in fact there are several hundred thousand Australians in desperate need of dental treatment that just cant; get it , you can’t just leave them in that state can you forever?

Pyne: Well Richo,  your dental scheme, and I was elected in 1993 your dental scheme was for a fixed number of consultations I think it was for a million consultations once that was reached it was to go back to the States, now whether it should have gone back to the States or not because they don’t seem to have done a very good job with it  is now a moot point all these years later and I think your dental scheme was a good scheme but it did have a finite life. Now obviously we want to return a dental scheme to the Commonwealth Government and we want to do the National Disability Scheme as well and once we get back into a budget surplus which is our highest priority we’ll be in a much better position to do those things. We’re not go to the next election making promises we can’t  keep I think Julia Gillard and Kevin Rudd have so devalued a politicians promise over the last four years that there is no point letting the public believe that we’re going to do things that we can’t afford to do.

Richardson: No I think your probably right about that mind you I wish I had time to question you about this $70 billion and whether it will really get cut but as usual I always seem to run out of time ,but Christopher Pyne your going to have one would imagine the biggest of years and watching you and Albanese cross swords over the next six to twelve months is going to be a lot of fun. And I intend to watch it closely

Pyne: Well, I’m looking forward to it. Thank you

Richardson: And I hope we can have the pleasure of your company again soon.

Pyne: I look forward to it.

Richardson: Christopher Pyne you’re a great human being thank you very much.

Pyne: Pleasure

ENDS