Sky News Richo

Subjects: Carbon Tax; Election 2013 campaign

EO&E.........

Graham Richardson:

Christopher Pyne, welcome to the programme.

Christopher Pyne:

Thanks Graham.

Richardson:

I wanted to start off with Gonski. I keep reading that what you’ve agreed to fund is the first few years where there is not much money and not the last couple where there is a lot of money. What’s the truth?

Pyne:

The truth is we are matching Labor’s funding proposal dollar for dollar over the first four years, which is the forward estimates, over the Budget period, which is the period of course for each school agreement. It’s a quadrennial agreement. Everything beyond that is a mirage, just like Kevin Rudd’s Northern Territory company tax cut - down to 20%. Just like his moving Garden Island from Sydney to Brisbane. And most of the promises he has made are all past the forecast, on the never never, and so is Labor’s promises about education funding. For the next four years, whether you vote Liberal or Labor, exactly same amount of money will flow to schools across Australia.

Richardson:

But when Barry O’Farrell signed up and others signed up, did they sign up to a mirage? Did they sign up to something that goes beyond the four years or not?

Pyne:

Well they signed up to the new school funding model and they know that the forward estimates run for four years, and that is what they can absolutely rely on. Everything else is an aspiration. It’s just as much the Coalition’s aspiration as anybody else’s -and we always support more funding for schools. But towards the end of that four year agreement, these agreements will all need to be renegotiated - whether it is the Catholic education system, the Independent system or the State and Territory schools systems - that the way it always works. If Labor is trying to pretend they’ve just locked in funding for years five and six, well they are trying to sell people a pup - it simply isn’t true.

Richardson:

Speaking of selling people pups, which I guess everyone does - your costings. After all the talk about ‘well before the election’, which were the exact words used by your boss, they’re coming out tomorrow. Is that early enough really?

Pyne:

Well Graham, most of our costings have already been released. As we have released spending proposals, we’ve announced savings measures. In fact, last Wednesday, Joe Hockey at the National Press Club announced $31 billion of new savings, so we haven’t hidden our savings at all. Labor, on the other hand, today, in a pathetic and embarrassing performance from Chris Bowen, tried to pretend they were releasing their costings. They released half of their sixty eight policies on one page and thirteen policies that they’ve announced they haven’t bothered to cost at all. So Labor has no clothes to wear on this issue. It is another giant hypocrisy from Chris Bowen and the Labor Party.

Richardson:

Yeah but forgetting hypocrisy and actually, I know it is impossible for you, but forgetting politics for the moment: Wouldn’t it be better for democracy, and I’m not blaming you or the Coalition because the reality is that Labor has always done the same thing, everybody has. Wouldn’t we all be better off seeing all costings put out well before the election day. In fact, why not a month before? Why not have both sides have it on the table early so we can know what we can have a crack at, instead of all of us having a crack at a mirage.

Pyne:

Well Graham you are right about one thing, Labor is certainly not in a position to lecture the Coalition because in 2007 and 2010 they released their costings at 5pm on the Friday night before the election. But as I said, we have released most of our savings measures, there won’t be any shocks or surprises tomorrow when the Coalition releases its Budget bottom line. Tony Abbott has made it very clear - that low and middle income earners have nothing to fear in the costings that will be released tomorrow. We’ve made sure that those people who can least afford it will be looked after, because that’s in Tony Abbott’s DNA.

Richardson:

Well what about if we just return to education at the moment, what about that question in Queensland about cuts to TAFE funding and Labor threatening, basically, that if the States want to cut TAFE funding then we’ll move in.

Pyne:

Well I’m glad you raised it Graham, because what has been exposed today is Kevin Rudd has taken $200 million from education in the investment fund, so he is robbing Peter to pay Paul in this promise that he’s made. So he is lecturing the States about cutting funding away from TAFE, which also of course is lecturing Jay Wetherill here in South Australia who sacked 150 TAFE workers here in South Australia, but he is ripping money away from one part of the TAFE sector to put it into the other. In other words, he’s not putting in any extra money at all. It’s just a pea and thimble trick.

Richardson:

What about the cuts? Are you envisaging any cuts to TAFE funding?

Pyne:

Well we’ve made it absolutely clear that there would be no cuts to education or health. They’ll be quarantined along with medical research, so we are not changing anything in health and education that would lead to less money being spent at all and that includes TAFE of course.

Richardson:

Do you think Labor is capable of coming up with any good ideas? Because I would have thought at the launch when Kevin Rudd talked about the extra tool allowance and things, they are sensible, are you going to pick those things up?

Pyne:

Well, we will always look at policies that have been announced. If there are good policies that the Coalition supports and that we can afford - that are affordable, believable and achievable, well of course we will look at them because any good Government would do that and of course after the 2010 election, Labor took many of our policy costings and used those in their own budget the following year, so that of course is not an unusual thing to do. What Kevin Rudd has failed to do in this election, Graham, he’s failed to talk about how he will cut the carbon tax, cut the mining tax, reduce the company tax rate, protect our borders and restore faith to the Budget and that’s why Labor is struggling in this campaign - because the key issues; cost of living, job security and border protection - Kevin Rudd has no answers to them. He just wanted to get revenge on Julia Gillard, get the job back. Once he got it back had no plans for the next three years.

Richardson:

Well I would have to concede that he hasn’t run the greatest of campaigns, and when you read my column on Friday you will read what I have to say about that because I think it is pretty ordinary.

Pyne:

I look forward to it.

Richardson:

It’s a pretty hard record to defend, but a lot of those mistakes, especially the fiscal ones - because you can excuse some of what Rudd did by talking the GFC - you can’t with what Gillard did, can you?

Pyne:

Well Labor has had a rotten three years and the question people will ask themselves at the ballot box on Saturday is, do they want another three years like the last three years? Kevin Rudd has had a lot to do with that. Kevin Rudd for the last three years has stalked Julia Gillard, never given her an even break, ensured that she could never get a serious message out to the Australian public and despite any of her best efforts Kevin Rudd has stomped all over those. He has run a very vicious campaign against Julia Gillard, now he wants to be re-elected and the Australian public are seeing right through him. They don’t want any more of the chaos, division and dysfunction that Kevin Rudd has been at the centre of.

Richardson:

Well tell me, what’s your prediction? What’s going to happen on Saturday? You know a bit about the numbers – you work them, you know what polling you’re getting. What do you think?

Pyne:

Well Graham this is my eighth election in Sturt - I’m always very, very nervous in the last 72 hours of an election campaign…

Richardson:

I’m prepared to put money on you winning Sturt, I’ve just got a feeling you might hang on.

Pyne:

At the moment I’m $1 to win in Sturt – 100-1, so I hope that’s true. I hope that’s how it ends up on election day and I’ve been working very hard in my electorate. My opponent’s been virtually invisible, so Labor’s given up on Sturt, which is a bit unfair on the voters of Sturt, but I’m not going to make any predictions. Up until 6pm on Saturday, this election could go any way, and I know it’s an old cliché to say that the only poll that counts is on Election Day, but three days out, I think I’d be mad to make any predictions. It’ll be a hard fought contest. Labor always throws everything at the Coalition in an election campaign as they should, because this is a government of the thirteenth largest economy in the world. It’s a serious election. We’ve got a clear choice: either we vote to abolish the Carbon Tax or not? The most amazing thing about this week has been that Labor has put the abolition of the Carbon Tax right back at the centre of debate. They’ve made it a referendum. On Saturday if you vote Labor you will keep the Carbon Tax…

Richardson:

Well that’s not true, an ETS is not a Carbon Tax, you know that.

Pyne:

They’ve made it imperative that people vote Liberal in the House of Representatives and the Senate.

Richardson:

Let’s get the one fact out. An ETS is not a Carbon Tax, don’t you agree?

Pyne:

They’re not introducing an ETS; they have a floating carbon price for the tax, or a fixed price for the Carbon Tax. They’re predicting $250 million more in the next two years – sorry, in the next year - from the Carbon Tax. They’re predicting the Carbon Tax will rise to $38. Now that is not the abolition of the Carbon Tax that Kevin Rudd promised.

Richardson:

No that’s what they’re saying the European price will be, and I think, by the way, that’s absurd, it’ll be nothing like that.

Pyne:

It’s bizarre.

Richardson:

Now can I just ask you. I saved it till the end because I think it’s important, about the look of the new government that takes over Australia on Sunday. Can you tell me, are serious about holding some commission to investigate the whole AWU Affair, the Bruce Wilson Affair, or will you accept the Police are doing a pretty reasonable job of doing it themselves.

Pyne:

Look Graham, I don’t think that the whole AWU Slush Fund Affair or the Craig Thomson Affair are at the centre of this election campaign. The things that are at the centre of this campaign is the Carbon Tax abolition, the Mining Tax, bringing back the Australian Building and Construction Commission, cutting the company tax rate to boost the economy, protecting our borders which Labor has manifestly been unable to do and building infrastructure for the 21st Century…

Richardson:

You’re not going to answer the question, is that the drift I’m getting?

Pyne:

What happens after the election on those issues are quite peripheral to the issues that people will vote about on Saturday, which is cost living, job security and border protection.

Richardson:

Well I don’t doubt that cost of living and I think just basically the state of the economy is the biggest single issue, and there’s not much doubt which way people are going to vote on this question, but there are other questions you can consider. It was worth a try, even you can concede that.

Pyne:

Well incredibly, Graham - incredibly, the Labor Party decided that the most important issue they could talk about this week was making it imperative for people to vote for the Liberal Party in the Senate in order to be able to abolish the Carbon Tax. You’ve been around for a long time, even longer than me and I’m sure your scratching your head at your former party’s tactics in this last week.

Richardson:

Well I’ve got to say I’m still a member of that party, it’s just I’m obviously not someone with a great deal of influence because there are a hell of a lot of things they’ve done that I wouldn’t have gone near. Christopher Pyne, I want to thank you, not just for tonight but for all you’ve done during the course of the last couple of years on this show and I also want to say when you’re a very important person next week, when you’re the Minister for Education, don’t forget us because I really would like to have you back on.

Pyne:

Well touchwood Graham. The election’s not over yet and I just hope that that turns out the way you’ve suggested it will. We’ve still got three days to go.

Richardson:

Well as I’ve said, I think I’d put my money on you, thank you for your time.

Pyne:

It’s always a pleasure.

[ENDS]